Doug Moo on translation - compiled

QTC has had the pleasure of hosting New Testament scholar Douglas Moo over the last few days. While probably not the most fruitful of his lectures to have live-blogged, I did take some notes from the exclusive ACT lecture that he did today on his experiences as a member and now head of the NIV translation committee.

You can find them, in order, here, here, here, here, here, here and here.

And for those visual learners, here's a snap of Doug with QTC's professional fanboi, Joseph Wee.

Questions for Moo

Wez: Why are there less conjunctions in English NIV than in the Greek?

Doug: They use more conjunctions in Greek than in English, we take into account what it adds to meaning and then put that into the way we translate it.


Ian: Do you take a particular perspective on tense/aspect in Greek, which is the basis of the language? (Or in Hebrew?)

Doug: No particular stance. Waltke is on the committee, so his stances do have a significant bearing on how we see Hebrew things.


Kutz: Any bits where you didn't get your way?

Doug: Any bit that you don't like, that's a vote I lost.


Kutz: Do you kick the Hebrew guys out of the room when translating the NT bits?

Doug: No, we work together as a single committee for everything. No sub-committees or separate work. This is actually really valuable as most of the time is spent on working out not so much what the original language means, but on how to render it in English.


Q: Do you employ an English stylist?

Doug: No. The NIV committee doesn't. The NLT committee did. Not always to the satisfaction of the NIV committee.


Doug: A totally new study Bible is coming, with Carson as the editor.


Jeremy: How is it decided who is on the committee?

Doug: A brief doctrinal statement, similar to NA evangelical association one. Have to sign up to that, have to be an expert in Greek or Hebrew, but after that it's the committee's choice as to who to invite. Try to keep a variety of English spoken, nationality, experts on different parts of Scripture, culture, etc.

Translation: things Doug Moo has learned #6

To be wary of 'Biblisch'.

"Daughter of Zion" but Zion IS the daughter. "Daughter Zion"

"Blessed is the one... who does not stand in the way of sinners" ("ie, the way sinners do things, not standing in front of them to block them")

• ESV - "Understandable English"
• NIV - "Natural English"
• NLT - "Easy English"

Metaphors

Live vs. Dead metaphors. Do you continue to use the metaphor, or do you substitute the word for the idea.

Examples:

• "Cut off" meaning "destroy"
• "walk" meaning "live," "direct one's life"
• "sleep" meaning "die" (Not enough evidence that this is a dead metaphor. So using 'sleep 'in death' may help.)

The difficulty of the varieties of English used today

This gives some license for the translator to use different expressions to translate the same underlying word.

Wez: But surely you should try to preserve the same rendering for a word within the same author?

Doug: Well, not so much just within the one author, but where we think the author is trying to make a link between the two usages.

Gender: Third Person Singular Generics

A problem not of understanding the Greek, but of understanding the English that you're translating into.

ESV keeps third-singular forms

Luke 9:23 - "And he said to all, "If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross..." (over 'literal' assumptions?)

NLT moves to second-person forms

"Then he said to the crowd, "If any of you wants to be my follower, you must ..." (but what do you lose here?)

CEB uses plurals

"All who want to come after me must say no to themselves, take up their cross ..."

NIV often uses the so-called 'singular' they

"Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross ..."

But, is that correct English?

NIV commissioned a study by the Collins Dictionaries, who own the Bank of English. (4.4 billion words)

Problem, then, is the different 'idiolects' that you find all over the world. What English are you translating into?

The database primarily filled the blank in "Every citizen was sent a ballot so that ____ could vote" with "they". This then is used as a snapshot of spoken English around the world. So the question is whether the lack of masculine focus in the original that would be present in the English by using 'his' is actually helpful.

Translation: things Doug Moo has learned #4

To make tough choices

The Italian proverb: Translators are traitors. True. You simply cannot bring across all the rhetoric, meaning, nuance and form of one language across to another.

So, again with sarx, some options:

• Translate in a way that approximates the sense for an English reader? - "sinful nature"

• Translate less interpretively, treating the word as a "technical" word that a reader will have to figure out? - "flesh" (Such as a novel about sailing. At first, you may not understand all or any of the technical terms, but eventually you'll get a 'feel' for it from the usage and context.)

So, the question is, do I think that my English speaking audience has the interest and the capacity to do the sort of work required to come to understand the technical term in its fullness and nuance.

Proverb: Never watch sausage or translations being made.

Interesting fact: Now more people who speak English as a second language than people who speak it as a first language.

The Hebrew of Proverbs 31:10

• "Woman of strength"? - too physical?
• "Woman of noble character"? - too ethical
• "Woman of excellence"? - OK, but... (went with this one)
• Kutz (But what about 'woman of nous' ?)

Translation: things Doug Moo has learned #3

Syntax and 'literal' translation

Col. 2:11 "te peritome tou xristou"

Circumcised 'of' Christ, or circumcised 'by' Christ?

Some seem to think that 'of' is the literal rendering of a Greek genitive. This isn't true. There is no 'literal' or default rendering of a genitive, simply a number of options.

A principle of Metzger
"As literal as possible, as free as necessary"

But this leaves questions, says Moo. Particularly, "as necessary" to accomplish what?

In practise: Colossians 4:5

Form, but no concern for meaning
In wisdom walk toward the outside the time buying up

Form over Meaning
Walk in wisdom toward outsiders, making the beset use of the time. (ESV)

Form and Meaning (NIV :P) (Doug is head of NIV translation committee)
Be wise in the way you act toward outsiders; make the most of every opportunity

Meaning, but less concern for form (NLT)
Live wisely among those who are not believers, and make the most of every opportunity.

Moo's point: All of these texts have made translation choices. None could be rightly called literal.

Things Doug Moo has learned #2

To detest the word "literal".

How most people think translation works:

You apply a code that translates each word from its Greek or Hebrew original to its English equivalent.

Ie, a greek word that menas "X" = English word

How translation really works:

There is no single, default 'meaning' of a word. Instead, words have a semantic domain. A semantic range. A word's meaning within its semantic range is determined by its context.

There may not actually be an English word that is equivalent or even has a similar semantic range.

An Illustration: the Greek word sarx

One possible translation option -> "a person"
Another translation option -> "sinful nature" (NIV 1984 & NLT) or "flesh" (NIV 2010)

There is no translation that seeks to always use the same word to translate sarx. To do so would be to betray the meaning of the Greek.

How you translate the word 'bit' into another language would depend greatly upon whether you were talking about horses or computers.

We should ban all talk such as "this word literally means..."

Moo on translation #1

Current bibles being read

KJV: 31% (old KJV: 18% and NKJV is 13%)
(T)NIV 30%
NLT 12%
ESV 7%
Others 20%